|
|
Post by brokennock on Jun 14, 2019 22:24:54 GMT -7
I've seen, and received a lot of great information on blade shapes, styles, and lengths; handle construction and so on. One thing I've gleaned, I think, is that full tang knives were pretty uncommon. So, amongst all this great knife data some of you have, is there any info regarding average length of the tang?
Thank you,
Dave
|
|
Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990 
|
Post by Keith on Jun 15, 2019 0:13:36 GMT -7
|
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Jun 15, 2019 6:31:07 GMT -7
There is limited space for attachments on this site, so images are preferred. This software allows up to 200mb of attachments at a maximum of 1mb per attachment. Not certain what ...the site links appear to have changed! means - can you explain? This is the link that shows for me on the home page - "https://minuteman.boards.net/". |
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Jun 15, 2019 7:07:16 GMT -7
Thank you Keith. I was close in my head. Thinking "half tang," I figured an average of about 4" for a handle and thus 2" for a tang. Most of these, at 1st glance, appear to be just under 2" or so.
|
|
Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990
|
Post by Keith on Jun 15, 2019 17:44:20 GMT -7
There is limited space for attachments on this site, so images are preferred. This software allows up to 200mb of attachments at a maximum of 1mb per attachment. Not certain what ...the site links appear to have changed! means - can you explain? This is the link that shows for me on the home page - "https://minuteman.boards.net/". The original links where I first obtained my PDFs, nothing to do with this forum. Keith. |
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Jun 15, 2019 18:06:53 GMT -7
Ok - we've had some quirkyness in the past that you've found.
|
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Jun 15, 2019 18:54:46 GMT -7
Ok - we've had some quirkyness in the past that you've found. Quirkyness? On a forum of adult people who like to dress up like it's 250 years ago and go play in the woods? You don't say. I have seen the quirkiness, and it is us. Lol. |
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Jun 15, 2019 18:58:07 GMT -7
|
|
Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990
|
Post by Keith on Jun 15, 2019 19:31:22 GMT -7
Ok - we've had some quirkyness in the past that you've found. Quirkyness? On a forum of adult people who like to dress up like it's 250 years ago and go play in the woods? You don't say. I have seen the quirkiness, and it is us. Lol.  |
|
|
|
Post by Sicilianhunter on Jun 15, 2019 22:03:01 GMT -7
Thank you Keith. I was close in my head. Thinking "half tang," I figured an average of about 4" for a handle and thus 2" for a tang. Most of these, at 1st glance, appear to be just under 2" or so. Thanks Le Loup, great visual! Nock, 2 inches is what I agree with. The pics look like 1 3/4" more or less, I would go with more just to make me feel better. A question about holes for pins in the tang: I saw a drawing that was from a specimen in the museum of the fur trade and the pins were arranged in more of a triangle than a line of three. Can anyone corroborate that info? My impression is that particular arrangement may be stronger with so little tang hanging onto the handle... |
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Jun 16, 2019 5:45:45 GMT -7
I hope Wick (LRB) will chime in.
Pins (usually 2 or 3) appear in a straight line for most/many/all of the period (trade) knives with a partial tang. When you get into the latter part of the 19th century, they deviate from this arrangement (there are some 5-pin knives).
|
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Jun 16, 2019 7:44:50 GMT -7
Wick posted this valuable information on MLF:
"The scalpers were imported by the tens of thousands from England, and France. The French used a different pattern with a dropped point for their common exports. The common wood grips were Beech, Boxwood, and exotics from SA and Africa, usually the reddish types. Never American woods unless an owners replacement. The English blades were usually about 1/16" thick, the French about 1/8". Commonly, tapered half tanged into a slotted one piece grip. The English commonly used 3 iron pins of about 3/32" dia., and smaller. The French used 2 of 1/8" dia. However, it seems that some of the French were 2 piece slabs, still with tapered half tanged blades, but with a third pin towards the rear of the grip. The English blades typically will have a straight slightly angled heel, the French a well rounded heel. English grips left an open slot underneath due to the tang width. The French made theirs a closer fit to wider tangs. This describes the more common types. There were different styles and variations from both countries."
|
|
lrb
City-dweller
Posts: 27
|
Post by lrb on Jun 18, 2019 5:38:32 GMT -7
I have seen one pic of a triangular 3 pin original blade, but do not have any pics. I would consider them less than common, but apparently were made. My first trade knives I made were of this pattern, because I took their production over from someone else, before I knew much of anything about them at all, and the guy producing them really knew nothing either. He just claimed they were the common correct pattern. Live and learn! The main reason full tangs were not quite as common as half tangs was economy. Many full tanged blades show up but not nearly as much as the half tangs. As far as economical shortcuts. Steel was expensive. Some English cutlers would forge weld iron tangs on steel blades. Both full and half tangs. On cleaned up artifacts, the joint can often be seen by color and visible texture. As far as I know, these were the English half tang scalpers in which the tangs are not tapered in thickness. Just my thoughts, but I don't think you would want a soft tapered half tang, whereas a tapered tempered steel tang has adequate strength for normal use.
|
|
Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990
|
Post by Keith on Jun 18, 2019 17:31:58 GMT -7
Thank you Keith. I was close in my head. Thinking "half tang," I figured an average of about 4" for a handle and thus 2" for a tang. Most of these, at 1st glance, appear to be just under 2" or so. Thanks Le Loup, great visual! Nock, 2 inches is what I agree with. The pics look like 1 3/4" more or less, I would go with more just to make me feel better. A question about holes for pins in the tang: I saw a drawing that was from a specimen in the museum of the fur trade and the pins were arranged in more of a triangle than a line of three. Can anyone corroborate that info? My impression is that particular arrangement may be stronger with so little tang hanging onto the handle... Bear in mind that in our period knives had a specific purpose, & unlike some bushcrafters these days these knives were not used for batoning or cutting or splitting wood! So the one, two & three pins were quite adequate regardless of the configuration of the pins. Keith. |
|
Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990
|
Post by Keith on Jun 18, 2019 17:48:59 GMT -7
  A couple of 19th century blades I picked up. 5 pins securing the handle. Keith. |
|
