Keith
City-dweller
Bushfire close but safe now. Getting some good rain.
Posts: 990
|
Post by Keith on Aug 14, 2019 22:59:10 GMT -7
Something about the hobby which I have never heard discussed but which I believe is important is deciding what you want out of it. People just getting into it always seem to rush into acquiring the clothing, guns and other gear, and I suspect they have never really given serious thought to what they want their place in the hobby to be. Most seem to assume it's all about having the "right look", a sort of adult show and tell, being on display at events and such, and being judged correctly HC/PC. That's certainly one way, and there is a large element of that aspect in most emulations, but it doesn't have to be all there is. I doubt anyone has gained more pleasure from the hobby than I have over the last 45+ years, but I have taken a rather different path. I figured out early on that the events, rendezvous, group activities were not for me, and I've been largely a solo act for most of that time. I'm never on display. My "correctness" is never judged by anyone but myself, and I'm a tough but understanding judge. I never purposely cheat, because to do so would run contrary to what I want from the hobby, and short-change nobody but myself. My main thrust has always been learning about the life of the old boys, the skills, the proper use of their equipment, the feel of their clothes in all weathers and situations, the taste of their food prepared as they would have done...well, you get the idea. I've said before that I seriously doubt I have a single piece of gear which is perfectly correct, but that it doesn't interfere with my pleasure. Knowing the difference, and what the real deal was is what it's all about for me, not being able to say that my gear is perfect. I insist that the feel, function, taste, etc., is as close as I can figure it was then, because experiencing what they did is the key to my efforts. Newbies are frequently warned to slow down, not rush in, do research about who, what, when so as to save themselves time, energy and money. Good advice. I would also recommend that early on some serious thought be given to what they want from the hobby, what is really important to them about it. It can make a big difference. It's a hard subject to put into words. I've tried before, 25 years ago. home.insightbb.com/~bspen/song.htmlSpence For me it is more a lifestyle than anything else, sure my days include doing a lot of chores & work in more modern clothing, but it would serve me no purpose to wear my period clothing every day to work in. I think this love of the lifestyle started way back when I was a kid, started off with a coonskin hat & a toy flintlock, moved on to a real bow & then a real gun. I agree Spence, no point in cheating yourself. I use an original fire steel, it does not spark as well as a modern copy, but I stick to the original. Keith.
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Aug 14, 2019 23:09:32 GMT -7
Thanks Spence. I don't know if it is because your "notebook" was one of the 1st big influences on my interests going beyond just shooting and hunting with a muzzleloader, but, I feel my path in this hobby is similar. I'm not interested in participating in reenactments, though I'd like to go witness some of the better ones pertaining to the F.&I. or American Revolution, and only have limited interest in joining other gatherings, mostly just to try and learn more. My basic goal is to learn all I can about the time period, and, be able to go hunt, trek, and enjoy the Outdoors using the skills, knowledge, and gear appropriate to the later half of the F.&I. through about 1790 or so. It is a lot more about my own satisfaction and knowledge than pleasing a judge at a juried event, or portraying an educational representation for others. However, I do feel that even if one is of similar mindset and motivation, one must learn as much as possible and maintain a certain vigilance regarding correctness in case one does encounter others while pursuing our hobby, so that we may continue to try to counter the continued passing along of the wrong information.
Spence has provided us with a cornucopia of reading. Anyone have any "don't buy," or "don't trust," books or authors?
|
|
|
Post by spence on Aug 15, 2019 6:46:31 GMT -7
I have no insight into what works for others in the hobby, but for me, one thing I’ve figured out is that the more I use the old gear the more I learn about it and the more comfortable I am with it. I can’t really understand it with only occasional or casual use. My shooting is an example of what I mean. I sometimes go full colonial, all the clothing and gear, including the guns and associated accouterments, as correct for my time period as I can make them. Other times I wear modern clothes and carry whatever gun fits the job at hand, disregarding historical correctness. No matter what the situation, though, I always shoot from the pouch, carry a powder horn and all the correct gear for that gun and use it in the correct way. So, I may be dressed in full camouflage and modern boots, but the gun, pouch and powder horn will be the same as always. It’s my way of gaining intimate familiarity with the gear and trying to really understand how the old boys used it, what problems they faced, and, maybe, how they solved them.
I remember Black Hand describing putting out beaver traps while wading to the knees in water with icebergs in it, dressed in period clothes. That will impress on your mind the difference between reading about a thing and actually doing it. If you are lucky, doing such things may bring about a rare “Ah, now I understand!” moment. I’m sure Black Hand does.
Spence
|
|
|
Post by straekat on Aug 15, 2019 13:30:26 GMT -7
“Ah, now I understand!” moment."
I treasure those moments, and the one I call "magic moments" when there is a very real sense the world has gone from the present, to the 18th century. They go by in a flash, and when your brain starts to think you've gone back in time, the real "magic" has passed. Although thinking can be a good thing, any recognition of the modern world destroys the sense of being there.
As the old commercial goes, "know what I mean Verne?"
|
|
|
Post by Sicilianhunter on Aug 17, 2019 5:34:34 GMT -7
Some EXCELLENT advice gentleman!! I was one of the -run head long with no understanding or research into what I was doing or where I was going- guys! Some of you here may remember that, however, with some help from forum folk I have evolved and I am still evolving. My goals fall somewhere in the middle of the general consensus in this thread: I found a local BP club ( the New Mexico Mountain Men) and learned to go the rendezvous route with them. Their main focus is on shooting skills and I have learned much from them and they have been gracious teachers. Authenticity is not their prime focus and it doesn't take away from my experience with them but accuracy is a focus for me and although I can appreciate the solos out there, personally, I enjoy socializing, the competition and camaraderie of groups. I have also discovered that groups that hold themselves to a higher standard helps me set a higher standard. With every advancement I make in clothes, gear, technique and knowledge I get a little better. My goal is to DO IT: hunt, fish, trap, scout, trek and with a purpose that is period behind it. I like to add in the critical thinking of the day to the costume with things like Scenario shoots and treks. I've learned more about what I am doing and who I am in the lifestyle and the people around me from when things go sideways than any other times...
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Aug 17, 2019 21:19:16 GMT -7
I have also discovered that groups that hold themselves to a higher standard helps me set a higher standard. Exactly correct. I have found this to be true in all my endeavours. I 1st found it to be true when I 1st started playing music for almost a living and studying to get better, for a long time I've told it to my pistol students and new pistol competitors, you do not get better playing with a group of people operating at your skill (knowledge) level, you get better running with those better than you and trying to keep up. It is good to have 1 or 2 friends at your level on the same journey, that play with a larger group of more skilled or knowledgeable people, so you can keep pushing eachother ahead. You are on the right track.
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Aug 18, 2019 16:43:44 GMT -7
You can be either your very best friend or very worst enemy....
I am OK with ignorance because it is curable. Willful ignorance is not and I have little tolerance for such people.
|
|
|
Post by Sicilianhunter on Aug 18, 2019 17:08:46 GMT -7
I have also discovered that groups that hold themselves to a higher standard helps me set a higher standard. Exactly correct. I have found this to be true in all my endeavours. I 1st found it to be true when I 1st started playing music for almost a living and studying to get better, for a long time I've told it to my pistol students and new pistol competitors, you do not get better playing with a group of people operating at your skill (knowledge) level, you get better running with those better than you and trying to keep up. It is good to have 1 or 2 friends at your level on the same journey, that play with a larger group of more skilled or knowledgeable people, so you can keep pushing eachother ahead. You are on the right track. Nock, Thanks!! This damn trail is rocky, the journey a long one, my feet hurt, my blanket is thin, I don't sleep much, the nights are long and cold but I'm having FUN!!
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Aug 19, 2019 5:55:13 GMT -7
The reward of knowing you did it the "right" way is the best thing one could achieve. It may not be 100% "right" as none of us will ever be, but knowing that you have come as close as possible is a great feeling. Unfortunately, it is short-lived, as you find something else that needs work . As with many other things, we fail forwards towards success. The trick is to make the failures quick and to keep them small - the entrenched, long-time-coming failures take far more work and are like ticks (difficult to dislodge and might leave festering parts behind along with the possibility of long-term problems/disability/disease).
|
|
|
Post by straekat on Aug 19, 2019 14:49:19 GMT -7
The reward of knowing you did it the "right" way is the best thing one could achieve. It may not be 100% "right" as none of us will ever be, but knowing that you have come as close as possible is a great feeling. Unfortunately, it is short-lived, as you find something else that needs work . As with many other things, we fail forwards towards success. The trick is to make the failures quick and to keep them small - the entrenched, long-time-coming failures take far more work and are like ticks (difficult to dislodge and might leave festering parts behind along with the possibility of long-term problems/disability/disease).
When I realize something I made wasn't done right, or should be corrected, it will bug me until I correct it and can stop thinking about it. There have been times when I get up in the middle of the night to make whatever it is/was....right. The other half sometimes thinks (with good reason) I'm nuts...although she does put up with me.
|
|
|
Post by Sicilianhunter on Aug 20, 2019 6:13:28 GMT -7
Hand, I decided many years ago when I quit smoking, that although I had quit, the rest of the world hadn't and I needed to deal with that in order to be successful in my mission. I look at "doing it right" the same way. I am slowly finding the people in my area that I could get to go out on a trek. They are on their own journeys and I let them know what my thoughts are but I don't impose them. I do my own "right" thing and if they want to wear hiking boot because they have tender feet or just don't want to suffer on the trail, I don't hold it against them or exclude them if they are willing. I am hoping that my efforts inspire them to step up their game but not a goal. This leads me to ask a question that may require another thread: Has any of us trying to be the ones striving to do it "right" thought of joining a group that has stringent requirements ? Now, before you answer, let's leave out the "I'm not a 'Join up' kinda' guy!"... I understand why some would think that way, however, there is something to be said for being held to a standard beyond your own, I have found this working with a trainer in the gym, in martial arts schools and in the work place, others have found this in the military or law enforcement. It's often said that the lifestyle is changing with the newer generation of reenactor having more access to accurate historical fact which slams head long against the reenactors of the past who can be largely misinformed and recalcitrant when it comes to adapting to a new climate in the lifestyle. Groups like the AMM, COHT and AMM are looked upon with disdain by many because of their high standards of authenticity. In my opinion, joining a group such as those puts you to the test worth taking...
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Aug 20, 2019 6:33:38 GMT -7
"the lifestyle is changing with the newer generation of reenactor having more access to accurate historical fact which slams head long against the reenactors of the past who can be largely misinformed and recalcitrant ," - Sicilianhunter
Excellent. Another thought and premise well stated, and useful elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Aug 20, 2019 7:28:47 GMT -7
This leads me to ask a question that may require another thread: Has any of us trying to be the ones striving to do it "right" thought of joining a group that has stringent requirements ? Now, before you answer, let's leave out the "I'm not a 'Join up' kinda' guy!"... I understand why some would think that way, however, there is something to be said for being held to a standard beyond your own, I have found this working with a trainer in the gym, in martial arts schools and in the work place, others have found this in the military or law enforcement. It's often said that the lifestyle is changing with the newer generation of reenactor having more access to accurate historical fact which slams head long against the reenactors of the past who can be largely misinformed and recalcitrant when it comes to adapting to a new climate in the lifestyle. Groups like the AMM, COHT and AMM are looked upon with disdain by many because of their high standards of authenticity. In my opinion, joining a group such as those puts you to the test worth taking... I have - considered joining the AMM. After reading their requirements, I realized that most of what I had already accomplished equaled or exceeded their standards and that a few of their "asks" were not HC/PC. Also, the need to be invited by someone else annoyed me - as if my self-worth needed to be approved by someone else. On the whole, becoming "beholden" to a group that might not follow my same path did not appeal to me either, so the idea was dropped. Ultimately, I try to exceed my own desires and standards even though I know I woefully fall short many times...
|
|
|
Post by Sicilianhunter on Aug 20, 2019 17:06:53 GMT -7
ever considered another group other than the AMM? I don't think any set of standards are flawless
|
|
|
Post by Black Hand on Aug 20, 2019 17:14:21 GMT -7
Nothing else in the local area - this is Mountain Man country. I run with a couple guys that do MM and another couple that do Colonial. Good bunch of guys with brains full of info and talented hands - I'm good...
|
|