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Post by brokennock on Jan 31, 2024 8:12:16 GMT -7
Ryan and Dave, Thank you both for all the information you guys have given me. I was laying in bed last night thinking on this, as something has always been there niggling which I couldn't put my finger on. And finally it came to me... I don't live in the states. When I'm out I try to imagine myself in the american 18th centruy but I'm surrounded by the smell of eucalyptys forests, mobs of kangaroos, screeching cockatoos, warbling magpies and roaring red stags. The British first landed here in 1780 under captain James Cook, who himself fought the french in the F&I war (although the dutch and french had explored Australias coast 100 years before), and settled later that decade. Perhaps rather than forcing the french side of my ancestry I just work with where I am and aim for a 1780s british/Australian settler. My love of french comes from my grandfather who emigrated to Aus from France in the 1940s, but my Irish side was here over 150 years prior to that. And realistically, I'm familiar with the Australian bush, its plants and animals. Maybe then I could be someone like Nicholas Creswell who's explored parts of the American colonies before moving on. Having taken a liking to American culture and dress (as I have in real life) the latter half of the 18th century styled clothing might work a little better. My longrifle and the English sporting gun when it arrives also won't be so out of place either. Very understandable line of thought. I love the idea of doing early settlement Austrailia, but I also agree with BH, don't let your geography limit you. If you really feel a drive to 1750s/1760s Colonial America, do it. Call it practice for when you get to come visit us. My location heavily influences my choices in what I do with all this, and I have often pondered if I would change much if I ever get to escape New England. But there are a lot of people who don't give it a second thought, or even a nano-second of a 1st thought. Lots of western macho "mountainy man" men all over the country,,, more "longhunter" types than there ever were originally, and spread over a vastly larger area too. I also don't see any reason you can't do a bit of both,,, as long as you either stick with the English, or adapt the persona and lifestyle of your Frenchman. Maybe he crossed south of the border into Upper NY or NH and stayed? Slowly blending his two cultures together over time. Maybe he got caught with someone's daughter and was "coerced" to stay, or fell in love for real and stayed. Maybe he was arrested for something and allowed to move about freely, but couldn't return until all conditions of his parole were met. Maybe he was just tired of pea soup and onions and decided to stay for a more wide ranging menu, (an old time widespread derogatory term in New England for French Canadians was "pea soupers") they hadn't invented all their fancy haute cuisine yet, much less brought it to Canada.
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Post by Black Hand on Jan 31, 2024 10:17:10 GMT -7
Or play in many sandboxes - I also do Fur Trade - easier since I live in a historical Fur Trade location. Lewis & Clark camped not but 10-15 miles from my house and the Great Falls of L&C fame are ~170 miles away. Unfortunately we have too many "Buckskinners" but there are a few that do it right (a few of which are part of my circle). One of these might interest you - they make custom clothing that is PC/HC and priced appropriately.
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Post by bushfire on Jan 31, 2024 15:19:55 GMT -7
So… Wanna sell that fusil? Jamais!
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RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
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Post by RyanAK on Jan 31, 2024 15:26:27 GMT -7
So… Wanna sell that fusil? Jamais! J'attendrai mon heure…
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Post by bushfire on Jan 31, 2024 15:29:11 GMT -7
Very understandable line of thought. I love the idea of doing early settlement Austrailia, but I also agree with BH, don't let your geography limit you. If you really feel a drive to 1750s/1760s Colonial America, do it. Call it practice for when you get to come visit us. My location heavily influences my choices in what I do with all this, and I have often pondered if I would change much if I ever get to escape New England. But there are a lot of people who don't give it a second thought, or even a nano-second of a 1st thought. Lots of western macho "mountainy man" men all over the country,,, more "longhunter" types than there ever were originally, and spread over a vastly larger area too. I also don't see any reason you can't do a bit of both,,, as long as you either stick with the English, or adapt the persona and lifestyle of your Frenchman. Maybe he crossed south of the border into Upper NY or NH and stayed? Slowly blending his two cultures together over time. Maybe he got caught with someone's daughter and was "coerced" to stay, or fell in love for real and stayed. Maybe he was arrested for something and allowed to move about freely, but couldn't return until all conditions of his parole were met. Maybe he was just tired of pea soup and onions and decided to stay for a more wide ranging menu, (an old time widespread derogatory term in New England for French Canadians was "pea soupers") they hadn't invented all their fancy haute cuisine yet, much less brought it to Canada. Firslty, that's very interesting with the pea soupers, that's not something that I was familiar with. If we look at historical examples of french and english in Australia, you could at a stretch, claim that its possible for someone of either or both descents/cultures to be here. www.theguardian.com/science/2021/dec/25/french-coast-the-early-explorers-who-sparked-british-fears-of-a-francophone-australiawww.sl.nsw.gov.au/stories/french-australia#:~:text=The%20history%20of%20the%20French,in%20Australia%20almost%20ever%20since.
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Post by bushfire on Jan 31, 2024 15:44:14 GMT -7
Or play in many sandboxes - I also do Fur Trade - easier since I live in a historical Fur Trade location. Lewis & Clark camped not but 10-15 miles from my house and the Great Falls of L&C fame are ~170 miles away. Unfortunately we have too many "Buckskinners" but there are a few that do it right (a few of which are part of my circle). One of these might interest you - they make custom clothing that is PC/HC and priced appropriately. That's fascinating being so close to where L&C camped. There are so many historical places I'd love to visit in the states, out west seeing the areas where they held rendezvous' or where Colter travelled would be amazing. It's really unfortunate that in Australia we don't care for our history the same way. It's really gone the other direction now where it's become mainstream to hate on any early european culture here. But I digress. I'm really open to using any clothing makers as long as it's within my budget. Currency exchange and shipping is a killer, which is why I was thinking it'd be easier to get as much as possible from the one place. But I am open to follwowing the direction of you gentlemen.
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Post by brokennock on Jan 31, 2024 19:56:53 GMT -7
Bethlehem Trading Post makes good stuff. When I can finally get some wool breaches I will probably go to them. I've always been pleased in my dealings with Quarter Master General as well. I plan to buy a pair of shoes and a new belt with a correct PC buckle from them as soon as I can. I get my silk scarves from them as well as some buttons and buckles, and thread.
See if you can find a painting of someone from the period that really resonates with you, then see who makes clothing that comes as close as possible to matching it. It doesn't have to be the main subject of the painting, maybe someone in the background or who is just ancillary to the subject. If the painting itself was not done in the period just research the artist and make sure they are known for doing good research, like Andrew Knez or Don Troiani.
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Post by straekat on Feb 8, 2024 9:29:37 GMT -7
Jack, .
Postal costs for items shipped internationally can be brutal.
There is a vendor in Australia you might be able to get some of the basic items from (i.e, breeches and a linen or hemp shirt). They sell on ebay and etsy, and according to their ebay store and website, have sold items for use in films, etc. Some of their items are hemp and/or linen, which are either expensive in the US or aren't offered. I haven't seen any of their items in hand, so I can't judge the quality of their offerings. If you contact them, ask where the stuff is made, and see if they will do special orders.
Eventually you should learn to do some basic sewing. It might seem difficult but it's not all that hard if you start off with simple techniques to make sewing kits, tool pouches and so on.
When I first started in the hobby, I asked my mother to make a shirt, vest, light coat, and trousers for me, from scratch. When she was done, I asked about a second shirt, she grudgingly made another out of wool. When the second one was done, she took me over to her sewing machine and said "watch and learn, know how to thread the machine, and after this, start making your own stuff." I took her advice and within a year was making all of my own clothing.
Unless people have a physique along the lines of a store manikin, off the rack or vendor bought clothing isn't going to fit the way properly made 18th century garments were made for people during that time period. To get a period looking garment a customized/tailored fit is important so the item doesn't look like costume.
Once you learn basic sewing, developing a pattern you can use that fits you the way you want isn't difficult. Go to a thrift store and buy trousers and a coat that fits you well enough that you can take it apart and use it as a basic pattern that can be modified for almost any period. Cuffs, lapels, and so on, can be added to the pattern by stapling or taping paper or scrap cloth to get the shape you want. Worn out "period" clothing if you can get it, are very useful and sometimes can be copied directly.
There are a few points about period clothing that are seldom considered by reenactors/living historians. Clothing and footwear can wear out very fast when worn everyday, especially if not cleaned, sweat and dirt will result in bacteria that can literally rot cloth around the armpits, crotch, etc. Period garments were made so linings could be easily removed, laundered and sewn back in (frequently as separate interior panels).
I suggest sticking with clothing styles that are as close to the period you wan to portray, and that are what your wife/family member would have known how to make. A man married at 20 circa 1750 might be on a second wife by the 1770's, and the second wife (if younger by a decade or two) would be likely to make clothing of -her- era, not of an older husband's. Also, the old "saw" about older clothing still being worn because it lasted 10 or 20 years is a "reenactorism" because most daily clothing worn outdoors doesn't last that long, particularly if the person does not have more than one or two spares of any particular item they wear daily. An "old" garment should show more than a little wear around the elbows, cuffs, collar, crotch area, pocket flaps, etc., and of course patches and more patches.
More on all of this later if you are interested in learning how to make your own....
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RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
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Post by RyanAK on Feb 8, 2024 9:59:19 GMT -7
Very well said, Cat.
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