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Post by paranger on Jan 25, 2021 10:09:38 GMT -7
With all this talk of hot beverages, I was wondering if anyone else has tried "Black drink?" It is a tea made from the roasted leaves of the yaupon holly indigenous to southeastern North America and long consumed by several of the numerous Native American tribes in the region (Cherokee, Creek, Choctaw, Chickasaw, Yucaipa, etc al). I recently purchased some to try, and though I am not much of a tea drinker, I rather enjoy it. Interestingly, I have read that is the only naturally caffeinated plant indigenous to NA. Thinking of adding it not only to my Cherokee impression, but others more generally, as it apparently caught on with Indian traders and packhorsemen as well.  |
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Post by spence on Jan 25, 2021 12:22:05 GMT -7
I've read of yaupon tea but haven't tried it.
In the history of the drink it's always said that it was used by NAs but then "forgotten" and later rediscovered. Do you know the time scale on that? Was it still being used during the AWI, for instance? I know a lot of plants were tried for tea while importing tea was verboten, but never read that yaupon was tried at that time.
Spence
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Post by paranger on Jan 25, 2021 15:08:01 GMT -7
I've read of yaupon tea but haven't tried it. In the history of the drink it's always said that it was used by NAs but then "forgotten" and later rediscovered. Do you know the time scale on that? Was it still being used during the AWI, for instance? I know a lot of plants were tried for tea while importing tea was verboten, but never read that yaupon was tried at that time. Spence I read that William Bartram noted in 1775 that the yaupon was called the "beloved tree" by the Cherokee, from which I infer that it was still in use at that time by the Cherokee, at least. English botanists gave yaupon the Latin name "Ilex Vomitoria" based on the mistaken belief that it was an emetic - a belief probably derived from the fact that some tribes used it in purification rituals. That may have stunted its popularity with Europeans a bit???  |
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Post by Black Hand on Jan 25, 2021 18:44:10 GMT -7
English botanists gave yaupon the Latin name "Ilex Vomitoria" based on the mistaken belief that it was an emetic - a belief probably derived from the fact that some tribes used it in purification rituals. That may have stunted its popularity with Europeans a bit??? Have you forgotten the "heroic medicine" common at the time? At the rate people were vomiting (and bleeding and purging) in the 18th & 19th century, you'd think it would be at the top of the Pharmacopia... |
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Post by Sicilianhunter on Jan 26, 2021 9:08:33 GMT -7
PARanger,
The first I ever hear of black drink was when Barbara LoGerfo mentioned it in a report while reading it aloud in our 6th grade class.
Yep, for some reason I remembered it from way back then and didn’t hear about it again until I found it in the book “The Packhorseman” which put it in my mental queue once more.
So glad you found it.
Please send us the details on where you found it.
Of course, I will need to try it!!
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ewoaf
City-dweller
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Post by ewoaf on Jan 26, 2021 9:39:21 GMT -7
I use it on a regular basis and it never went out of use among certain cultures. The vomiting comes from another psychoactive root that was added for ceremonial use, but plain old cassina was always used as a common place secular beverage. Osceola's name in Mvskogee is Asi Yvholo meaning black drink singer; a name received after a remarkable performance during a yearly busk, or green corn dance during which the sacrament is consumed.
It does indeed contain caffeine on par with green tea. Contrary to popular belief, the caffeine difference between male and female plants is so negligible as to make no perceptible difference. Green leaf can be used but only the roasted leaf makes the black drink. The only difference in the end is the flavor and colour as roasting doesn't seem to effect the alkaloids. Green leaf looks clear like green tea.
It's popularity among non native consumers increased as the popularity of tea decreased from obvious politics. The consumption of coffee grew as well, and hindsight being what it is, we know coffee eventually won over the three. I'd say Youpon peaked by early Victorian, but only with poorer backwoods types, never really making it in the mainstream markets until the second decade of the 21st c.
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Post by paranger on Jan 26, 2021 10:34:29 GMT -7
PARanger, The first I ever hear of black drink was when Barbara LoGerfo mentioned it in a report while reading it aloud in our 6th grade class. Yep, for some reason I remembered it from way back then and didn’t hear about it again until I found it in the book “The Packhorseman” which put it in my mental queue once more. So glad you found it. Please send us the details on where you found it. Of course, I will need to try it!! SH - You can find it online (even through Amazon) from a number of different vendors. Mine is from a Florida based outfit called Yaupon Brothers. |
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Post by Sicilianhunter on Jan 28, 2021 7:15:26 GMT -7
FYI:
“Different groups used the black drink for different purposes, but for many it was a key component of a purification ritual before battle or other important events. Its high caffeine content - as much as six times that of strong coffee, by some estimates - induced sweating. Rapid consumption of large quantities of the hot drink allowed men to vomit, an important part of the purification ritual.”
Interesting and may explain the “vomitoria”
Part
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ewoaf
City-dweller
Posts: 203
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Post by ewoaf on Jan 29, 2021 7:32:45 GMT -7
FYI: “Different groups used the black drink for different purposes, but for many it was a key component of a purification ritual before battle or other important events. Its high caffeine content - as much as six times that of strong coffee, by some estimates - induced sweating. Rapid consumption of large quantities of the hot drink allowed men to vomit, an important part of the purification ritual.” Interesting and may explain the “vomitoria” Part To reiterate, ilex vomitoria is not an emetic. The sacremental black drink was a combination of i. vomitoria and another root that was a psychoactive emetic, giving the illusion of i. vomitoria having emetic alkaloids to it's discover, William Bartram who was the first to classify the species in the 1760s after being introduced to it by southeastern natives. The herbal additive was unknown to Bartram thus giving him the impression of it being emetic. The purpose of a purge was either ceremonial purification or to demonstrate to ones counterpart that one was free of intoxicating influences and of sound mind, say prior to conducting a negotiation or treaty for example. |
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Post by Sicilianhunter on Feb 2, 2021 8:29:00 GMT -7
Got my black drink makings in the mail yesterday and had a cup for breakfast this morning.
Pretty tasty!!
Reminds me of a green tea flavor.
Pleasant drink just plain
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Post by paranger on Feb 2, 2021 9:53:18 GMT -7
Got my black drink makings in the mail yesterday and had a cup for breakfast this morning. Pretty tasty!! Reminds me of a green tea flavor. Pleasant drink just plain I had the same thought when I first tried it - reminded me of green tea as well. |
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Post by Richard on Feb 16, 2021 21:46:21 GMT -7
Reading this thread when I realized that I have had Yaupon tea! Several years ago, bought a bag somewhere on the Outer Banks, NC. if I recall correctly, though it may have been in Virginia, on our way home. Just looked liked something I should try. I just broke the leaves up in my fingers, and steeped them in the mug with water from the kettle. A very enjoyable drink for late evening. After it was gone, I kind of forgot about it, until now. I will be going back later this year, and am making a note to buy some more. Thank you, all.
Richard/Grumpa
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