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Post by armando on Feb 18, 2020 7:02:10 GMT -7
A question: my teenage boys wish to visit a local event at historic site (battle reenactment) as visitors and spectators but wanted us (the family) to go in period attire (all four of us are in various stages of kit development) to attend the market and what not.
I wondered, is this a faux paux/frowned upon if you are not one of the official volunteer historical reenactors? When we go stay in Colonial Williamsburg, we always dress out (or our local club shoots) so they were pretty excited about it but wasn't sure if that was just considered "bad form" or just outright banned at these events.
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ewoaf
City-dweller
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Post by ewoaf on Feb 18, 2020 8:36:30 GMT -7
It really depends. Williamsburg for example loves visitors that dress out. I certainly have, even done some side work there for a client. Despite their, or any other event's policy on the matter, the reality of being confused for an employee exists. I've been mistaken for a costumed interpreter there plenty. When that happens you have to realize that like it or not, intentional or not, you're representing CW. It's only courteous to act accordingly. Most people can't tell the difference. I have good friends that live and work there, so I'm going to do nothing to cast them in a bad light, much less ruin anyone's privileges.
At any other event, you may or may not have paid or volunteer interpreters. You may be in the position to be mistaken as one, so prepared for a family to ask, "who are you?" or any other awkward question. If you can navigate that dynamic, then rave on. If it's a juried event, it's most likely invitation only in which case it's best not to dress out. Getting invited is usually no more difficult than connecting on social media, or striking up a convo and showing off phone pics. People are eager to mentor, help, or loan to those not up to a standard.
The whole point of living history is educating the public, which is why it's called public history. If one's motivations are simply to larp, there are other private venues. Being an asset to the event and the staff rather than a liability is all it really boils down to.
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coot
City-dweller
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Post by coot on Feb 18, 2020 8:39:56 GMT -7
Standards and expectations vary from event to event. As one example, at the Fort Frederick Market Fair, participants are juried in to be able to attend. Participants are given a color coded ribbon to wear somewhere on their person or gear during the event. The general public can wear whatever they like as long as it is not profane or grossly offensive. One guy shows up every year or two in an extremely good 1880s? cowboy outfit & two others in ACW uniforms, also well done but completely out of time - of course the T-shirts & jeans worn by most of the general public are also out of time. I suggest that you ask the event organizers/hosts what they prefer.
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Post by brokennock on Feb 18, 2020 10:45:49 GMT -7
Two very good responses above.
Ewoaf, nails something important in his statement about these places and events having a purpose of educating the public. And, that you may be mistaken for staff, and thus asked questions. Do your outfits clear the bar of being able to accurately represent the time and place? If not, are you able to answer questions in a way that educates people that certain things aren't correct, yet, that it is a work in progress and tell them what would be correct? This, for me, is a large part of my frustration with some of the arguments elsewhere about hc/pc accuracy. If someone wants an item, clothing, piece of gear, that is not provable to the time and place but maybe possible based on material and construction, believable to someone attending an event as a spectator but not someone who studies these things, this is fine, if they are NOT in front of the public in such a way as to falsely educate anyone. So, have answers to questions about your clothing and gear ready,,,,, and send us pictures.
Not being someone who generally attends these things, I am wondering if some of the folks running such an event might have some input on how they would like you to respond to questions regarding your interpretation.
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Post by brokennock on Feb 18, 2020 10:46:53 GMT -7
Oh. And I think this is an excellent question and topic for a conversation by the way...
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Post by artificer on Feb 18, 2020 11:09:06 GMT -7
Armando,
Great question and you already received good advice from ewoaf and coot.
May I ask what type of event you are planning to attend and what time period/gear they do at the event? We can give you even more advice if we knew that.
Generally speaking and when it is not a juried event (which you may not run into anyway), people who do living histories are always looking for new members and/or new folks to the hobby. That is a major part of the reason to do the event, though of course not the only reason.
Over the years I've been on both sides of being a visitor and being a participant receiving visitors, as have other forum members. I loved doing living histories in different time periods and interacting with the visitors. Matter of fact, I looked for ways to sort of "pull them into" whatever time period we were doing at each event.
With more information, we can help you more.
Gus
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ewoaf
City-dweller
Posts: 203
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Post by ewoaf on Feb 18, 2020 12:37:56 GMT -7
One thing I do find offensive from multiple standpoints are folks that crash an event that are completely out of context. For example at a colonial event in Utah out pops president Lincoln. He wanted attention, and one thing I've noticed is that some people are just in it for attention. It's insulting to professionals that are working hard there to have someone show up with the attitude that "oh anyone can do this, watch me!" But they're not doing it because their portrayal is a century off target! It's a liability to the event committee because the savvy public is suddenly wondering why they hired a Lincoln for what was advertised as an 18thc event. So usually someone has a come to Jesus talk and kicks them out, taking productive attentions away from their job.
Same goes for really bad and sloppy portrayals, which begs the question of what's bad. It's relative and there has to be some leeway. When there's a void in the historical record you do what interpreters do... interpret. Academics get to write "we don't know". Interpreters have to fill the gaps as best we can, and because we're all different, we disagree a lot. As long as people know how to research, have familiarity with it, can be articulate in their opinions, it's all good. You can do your version, I'll do mine, and the public gets more sides of the story.
If I have a standard, it's because I'm holding myself to it, not you. My standards aren't for everyone, just like my portrayals aren't for everyone, your portrayals, whatever. What makes this community awesome is that diversity in specialization. Authenticity gets more expensive the higher it gets. I've been poor before, and I've also done really well at times. We all run a spectrum on that too. Research can, and should, be a drain on resources.
Living history is performance based, not outcome based. Are you doing the best you can with what you have in the present up to the standard you set for yourself? Are you improving, and is your standard incrementally improving? As long as you can answer yes, you're probably an asset to the community, therefore worthy of everyone's approbation no matter how fancy they think they are. Anyone doing anything to forward the public's better understanding of history is a good thing no matter how much it helps.
So just call or email events you want to go to and chat people up. Everyone likes free help, and if they don't, you've learned who not to trust.
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Post by artificer on Feb 18, 2020 16:42:33 GMT -7
Armando,
You mentioned going to a battle reenactment and that's a bit different than a living history.
Some folks who do battle reenactments are not comfortable interacting with visitors, even though they may be very authentic and knowledgeable. They may be shy or don't feel they can do a good job of interpreting for visitors or they might just have a reserved personality. So if you run into someone like that, don't take it as a slight to you or your sons.
Some groups will assign or have someone who volunteers to guard the camp. Sometimes this person/s will offer to escort you through the camp and answer questions. I used to do this when a Private Soldier in the Major's Coy of the 42nd Royal Highland Regiment. I would go up to people who looked interested and offer to escort them through our camp and answer questions. We even had one member who laid out a rather impressive display of what a Soldier carried in the period.
The years I did the "Under the Red Coat" event at Colonial Williamsburg, their guidelines were they encouraged us to do "First Person" or act in the period if we could or were comfortable doing it, but we weren't required to do it. Actually we were not required to get into conversations or interact with visitors at all, but if we did CW just wanted us to remember we represented CW and they were guests of CW and act appropriately courteous. Of course CW still liked us to talk to guests even if we or they were not comfortable with First Person interpretation.
Since there are not a lot of people who recognize when one is doing First Person, I would slip in and out of character, depending on the visitor/s and depending on their questions. For example if I got a question I as a Private would not have known the answer to, I would explain that was the business of the Officers and they don't explain things to Private Soldiers, but THEN I would drop out of character and explain it as best I could. As Ewoaf mentioned, I would tell them when I didn't know something or explain some things were looked at in different ways by different people interested in the period. I would joke that even after over 30 years of doing this stuff, I certainly did not know everything. Occasionally, though, one meets visitors who know a lot of the period. At my first "Under the Red Coat," I was just finishing escorting a small group of visitors and they were preparing to move on when a lovely lady near my age came up and asked some very unusual and detailed questions that demonstrated much more than the average knowledge of the period. However, she knew very little of Scots in the period.
After a few questions that were challenging to answer, she asked, "What are Scots like you doing fighting for the English?" I replied we were loyal subjects of His Majesty the King, so it was our pleasure as well as our duty. She looked very surprised and said, "But as a Scot, you should be on OUR side." (She meant the Patriot side.) She was somewhat astounded when I informed her my Clan had supported the King (of England and Great Britain) for decades and had even fought against other Scottish Clans during the Uprising of the '45. Well, that went over her head a bit so she asked, "Well, what religion are you?" I informed her I was a Presbyterian, though I leaned strongly towards Calvinism. So she said, "Well that means you should be supporting us!" I replied, "Dear Lady, as Protestants we support the King, not like the Catholic Jacobites."
She asked a lot more questions and then I informed her it was interesting to talk to someone who knew so much of the period, though I did not mention she didn't know much about the Scots. I then thanked her on behalf of CW for her visit (something I came up with on my own) and then she asked, "Do you work for the Foundation?" I replied I didn't, though I would love to.
She then informed me she worked for CW and her Doctorate was in 18th century World Trade. So I asked if she knew how the Scots had almost bankrupted Scotland at the beginning of the century in an attempt to cut a canal through the Isthmus of Panama? Her jaw dropped and said she had never heard of it. I tried to hide my surprise, considering her Doctorate, but it was just not an avenue she had heard of. I explained a little on it and then she had to take off. She did return the next day and thanked me intently and said he had done some research on it and looked forward to more. So even folks with a Doctorate on the period, won't know everything.
Gus
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ewoaf
City-dweller
Posts: 203
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Post by ewoaf on Feb 18, 2020 16:50:21 GMT -7
Nobody knows it all, especially PhDs. Dissertations are specific AF. It only demonstrates an ability to research and contribute. It's what you do after postdoc that matters. We all have to stay relevant and keep learning more.
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Post by artificer on Feb 19, 2020 2:12:28 GMT -7
Armando,
It just struck me you may not know at most battle reenactments; most of the troops, wives, children, etc. are not professional reenactors. We used to joke that we would love to be, because then we could get PAID for what we did.
Colonial Williamsburg was one of the few sites that I've been involved with that gave reenactors anything and they gave each of us $10.00 for the event "Under the Red Coat." However, they did something very interesting. They actually had a "Pay Call" during the event and paid us in Susan Anthony Dollars (Gold Finish) and/or Sacajawea Dollars (Silver Finish) depending on our ranks. We Private Soldiers got all Silver Sacajawea Dollars, while NCO's and Officers got a mixture to represent their higher pay. I think Corporals got one gold coin and the rest silver, Sergeants got two gold coins and the rest silver and Officers got more gold coins or even all gold coins, depending on their rank. However, that made me feel very old in 2005 as I was one of the few "soldiers" who had ever actually been paid in cash at a real Pay Call while on Active Duty.
One thing I would suggest if and when you go through the camps is to tell the reenactors you are new to this and perhaps you would like to ask questions. Many, if not most groups are very welcoming and especially when visiting folks have already attempted to get their gear together, because it shows you have a sincere interest in the period. Many times when the camps are rather empty due to the men drilling or doing other things, you will get a lot of information from the Wives and Lady reenactors. Of course if you are not welcomed at one or a very few groups, consider that their loss and you probably would not want to have much to do with that group/groups anyway. Just please understand there are not many groups like that, but some exist.
Gus
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