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Post by straekat on Dec 10, 2019 12:17:59 GMT -7
Keith's blog entry on the early French-Canadian style capote inspired me to try making one. The version Keith posted is based on a very nice reproduction. woodsrunnersdiary.blogspot.com/2012/12/more-on-french-capot.htmlI looked at the details that could be seen in the photos, and then at on-line photos. Fort Ticonderoga re-enactment criteria have good description of clothing that is acceptable for French-Indian and also Rev war events, and are supplemented by photos. I decided I would make one similar to the capote Keith's site shows, although with a few changes. I did not want one made from blanket material, and used a serge grey wool. Blanket wool can be warm, however it is not particularly water-resistant. The serge I chose was a lighter weight, and was fulled by boiling the material and ironing it. Favored period colors tended towards blue, brown (home-made woolens), and if made by Europeans, grey was favored by the French back in Europe. White is a favorite of re-enactors because of winter-time events and as camo, although sources I've read suggest it was not that favored by Canadians. The concept I was aiming at is this:  Instead of mariner style cuffs, I decide to use roll-back cuffs that could be lowered and pulled down similar to a Victorian ladies's muff, so that I could keep my hands worn without having to put on and take off gloves.
The roll-bak cuffs can be made with buttons to hold the cuffs up, however, they aren't absolutely necessary. The cuffs can be tacked in place with needle and thread along the seam lines. Doing that allows the cuffs to be used as open pocket to put items such as folded paper (maps) and other items that might be needed for quick access.  I haven't decided whether to sew small pockets with a flap closure inside the cuffs to hold small items I don't want to lose. I'm thinking of similar pockets inside the Capote to hold a magnifying/burning glass and reading glasses.
The Capotes shown here, and the one on Keith's site show the skirts have side pleats. Some people have pleats or fold, that don't open up. I wanted mine so they were open, and I could reach through the opening in order to get to the pockets on my breeches, and waistcoat. Yes, I have this thing about pockets....they can be good to have instead of dumping everything into a haversack. My impression is as a civilians, and a market wallet can be worse than using a haversack as a catch-all. So, for me...pockets. Someone thinking of making one of these would do well to look at commercial patterns, determine how it will need to be adjusted to fit, and may also need to modify the pattern so that it looks like a period capote. I have J P Ryans military regimental coat pattern, and it is a good starting point. I encountered blog-entires by people who have used and modified the pattern.  There are three variants of this pattern. The one in the middle comes closest however, the center line of the coat front should overlap by several inches. It has turn-back cuffs and the instructions say how to make them. There is no hood, although adding one is not a problem. (Part 2)
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Post by straekat on Dec 10, 2019 13:01:52 GMT -7
Part 2,
I found this when browsing for information on capotes. It is a quick guide on how to modify the J P Ryan pattern and use it for the basis of making a capote.
The file is rudimentary, and with a little study it's possible to figure out what to do.
Capotes normally did not have outside pockets, and various references indicate period overwear was often un-lined. Sometimes they were.
I decide to make a partial liner that would extend from the neck to the waist, and line the arms also. The reasoning here is the texture and surface of unlined wool can result in the material on shirt sleeves binding when you put the capote on. Also, lining the upper back shoulders adds an extra layer to slow down water draining down my back. Another reason has to do with lining helping a garment keep it's shape. The weight of wool sleeves an stretch the sleeves length if not supported.
Period garment linings were sometimes sewn as separate panels, with the seams of outer and inner panels joined together. That was so worn, damaged, or soiled pieces could be taken out, replaced, or laundered without having to do the entire garment.
I went that route.
If you look at the figure in the first post, wearing the green/gray capote and the long pointy hood, I decided to use the same idea. If the hood is too small around the face, pulling it up or down is going to be constricted. You also don't want the hood too loose and it can slide around on the hood. You will need to make a cheap disposable mock up before decided on what works for you. The hood should be angular, not rounded in the back. The pointy shape also helps the hood hang properly down the back and looks better when seen from the back.
The J P Ryan isn't cheap, and you will have to order it on-line. I think the current price is in the neighborhood of $25-30, depending on who and where you get it.
There....is an alternative, however it requires knowing what is wrong with the pattern and making modifications. I'm mentioning it because the Ryan patterns are snug and can be hard to get on, ever if the size is correct. Period posture was upright with the shoulders pulled back. Period garments are narrower in the back than modern ones, and may be hard to get used to. The sleeve arm openings are also higher and smaller than modern clothing.
If you're figure is not the linear, skinny type of the 18th century, a Ryan pattern may not be for you.
What's the alternative pattern? Don't gag. It's a very good starting point, provided you know what has to be done. It is made for the modern male that has a few extra "avoir dupois" in the wrong places, and is very easy to get on or off. The pattern is also large enough that it can be used to make an capote that can be worn over a waistcoat, sleeved or otherwise, and even a frock/justaucorps.
Here it is....
Done gagging? Ok, you can buy it during the fall at places like Walmart for under $10, Joann Fabrics for a tad more, and if you can't find one of those outlets near by, they are available on-line. Save the coat pattern, trash the rest of, except for the instructions.
Despite the Johnny Depp dude wanna-be on the front, the coat is in the ball-park for the period circa 1710-1730.
What has to be done to make it workable. The center line of the coat is rounded and curves towards the shoulders towards the top. The center line should also be adjusted to overlap about 4 inches. The side skirts use a pieced panel to create pleats that can be added to the coat because of pattern and material width incompatibility problems. Period garments were often pieced together, so this isn't really a problem.
Where the side pleats/folds are, you will have to modify the patern before cutting it, by adding rectangular "tabs" to it, between the waist-line area and the bottom line of the skits.
You really do want to add pleat or folds. If you don't and sew up the sides, the garment might bind, causing the front overlap to open and move around if you are walking or running, and/or the same thing regarding the rear vent seam. The extra material being folded over and with the folded seams is seen on period frock coats and justaucorps. It's period, and it creates a lot of room for movement, setting, et. The open side seams not only allow you to reach pockets underneath, they allow mounting and riding a horse, climbing trees, or vigorous moving, very nicely.
The skirts will be about 2" or so above the knees, depending on the size you pick and your height. I wanted mine to be below the knee pan so I could wear it over a sleeved waistcoat or jacket, and cover the bottom of the garment underneath. A longer length also keeps water from dripping onto the knees if the edge is below it.
No external pockets, add a small liner, make the cuffs small enough that they are close to the sleeve seams, and add the hood.
The choice of material is something you will have to decide on. A loose weave will require blanket-stitching all of the raw edges or it will start to unravel. Tightly woven wool that has been fulled doesn't require blanet stitching, however I did that on all of the raw edges with mine. That required over 300 yards of thread, and possibly 50-60 hours of hand-sewing over several months (about 1-2 hours per day since last October).
Whatever pattern you use, it will require roughly 5 yards to lay out the pattern. Treating before hand will help prevent shrinking if it is ever washed. Once it's soaked due to the weather, it not treated, it may not fit well afterwards.
I'm currently having technical problems with my digital camera, and laptop communicating with each other. Once that get's worked out, I'll post pictures of what the finished capote looks like. Give me a day or two...
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Post by spence on Dec 10, 2019 18:33:44 GMT -7
Nice thread, straekat. I have a couple of items I've collected which might be of at least tangential interest.
I have a favorite little book, Frontier Memories, which is composed of excerpts from the John Dabney Shane interviews, part of the Draper manuscripts. It was compiled by Dale Payne in 2002. They describe events on the Kentucky frontier in the last quarter of the 18th century.
In the 18th century wool broadcloth was a smooth, highly fulled/felted fabric with very high weather resistance. It was dense and wound up very tightly woven so that cut edges wouldn't ravel, didn't need to be hemmed. It was apparently favored for capotes by some.
John Hanks interview: activities described in the area of Wheeling:
pg. 69 "Silas Zane and George Green went to Detroit driving cattle and made a great amount, bring back a great pile of money with them. They went a 2nd time and my mother made some cappo-coats for them to take along and sell among the Indians, made them of blue broadcloth, with a cap or hood to draw over the head, otherwise they were like a match coat. I recollect that I sewed some on them myself."
Benjamin Stites interview:
pg. 16 " I bought a cappo of Blackfish, that I had to freeze, to get the lice out. Broadcloth."
and...
pg. 17 "The other Indian caught him by the cappo, and tore off a great slit. As he passed along he came to a great log and threw himself into the forks of it. His cappo being of the same color, he heard the Indians run along and back without seeing him."
Spence
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Post by brokennock on Dec 10, 2019 19:32:00 GMT -7
Great posts. Would you happen to have a link to the Fort Ticonderoga re-enactment criteria that you mentioned?
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Post by straekat on Dec 11, 2019 8:43:56 GMT -7
Nock,
For Ticonderoga posts a calendar of upcoming events for re-enactors with clothing/gear guidelines. After an event, they are taken down. Finding guidelines for past events relies on being able to find cached links. After seeing some of those guidelines disappear I started using word string and the images that brought up. Then I'd look for links. When I find a cached file that's not directly accessible from the main page of a site, I pint the entire web-page out to file and store in on my backup HDs. There files are often several megabytes in size, and are too large to post here.
Here are a few of the smaller files I printed out in pdf format:
Ok, here's a few links I can point you to for a starting point. You'll have to do a little rooting around, however you can get to what is interesting.
The pinterest files are full of pitctures taken from the Ticondergoa event schedule. If you do a word search of "Ticonderoga clothing" you'll get numerous hits, and will have some wading to go through.
Clothing standards, French Troupe de Terre and Troupe de la Marine - Fort Ticonderoga
fort ticonderoga clothing - Google Search
If you find upcoming events at Ti, look for a link (usually upper right hand corner) or elsewhere on the page that will direct re-enactors to additional information. That's where the Fort posts guidelines.
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Post by straekat on Dec 11, 2019 14:16:10 GMT -7
Picture time... From the front: 
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Post by straekat on Dec 11, 2019 14:26:43 GMT -7
Back, vented rear overlaps instead of split. This is the same as seen on the capote Keith posted. I suggest this version, instead of the simple "V" opening. The "V" style is easy to make, although it's not correct for the French and Indian war era (the style I chose). When moving around the edges can open up, exposing the seat of the breeches.  The back overlap starts slightly below the small part of the back and the tip of the "elf hood" is several inches above it. Mine is roughly a hand-width above where a sash closure would be. |
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Post by straekat on Dec 11, 2019 14:32:49 GMT -7
The right hand side seam in the photo opens and the waistcoat and breeches pockets can be easily reached without having to lift the side skirts. The left side seam is the same.
The pleats or folds are an inch wide, and were heavily pressed with a steam iron from both sides. This helps reduce bulk and keep the edges narrow. The pleats were tacked along the edges so the creases would not loosen up and bulk up in the future.
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Post by straekat on Dec 11, 2019 14:35:11 GMT -7
Although I have the J P Ryan pattern, I opted to use and modify the "Depp" pattern instead. I'll describe the individual steps I took in the next several posts.
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Post by Black Hand on Dec 11, 2019 16:14:15 GMT -7
The Fireshot browser extension allows you to save material as a PDF. Avoids printing - you keep the original formatting and images as a file on your computer.
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Post by brokennock on Dec 11, 2019 21:08:24 GMT -7
Thanks, I think.... (scratching head)
"find cached links. After seeing some of those guidelines disappear I started using word string and the images that brought up. Then I'd look for links. When I find a cached file that's not directly accessible from the main page of a site, I pint the entire web-page out to file and store in on my backup HDs. There files are often several megabytes in size, and are too large to post here..."
What language is this?
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Post by brokennock on Dec 11, 2019 22:32:33 GMT -7
Your Capote came out great. I am really impressed. I will download the pdf files you provided and play with some of the links when I can sit down with my laptop. This phone is getting too old and overloaded.
Thank you again.
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Post by straekat on Dec 12, 2019 6:33:20 GMT -7
Thanks, I think.... (scratching head) ................ What language is this?
Nerdic.  |
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Post by straekat on Dec 12, 2019 7:31:01 GMT -7
Here's the process:
Decide how much clothing you intend to wear under the capote. The J P Ryan pattern will fit snugly similar to a regimental or frock coat if you want plan to wear a shirt and waistcoat (probably without sleeves). The sleeves in the pattern are snug, and may be tight if your arms are on the bulky side. The "Depp" is large enough that you can wear several layers underneath. The sleeves are loose enough to wear over a sleeved waistcoat, jacket, or frock.
I said earlier in the thread, I chose to use the "Depp" pattern since I wanted a looser fit, and to layer clothing underneath.
Once you have the pattern, open it up, read through it a few times to get a sense of what is going on.
The amount of material? I used about 5 yards of 60" wide wool, a little less than two yards of lining material for the upper inside of the coat (cotton twill...yes the French had cotton, and since this is a French style capote....go for it!), and a smooth polished cotton for the sleeve lining. I've already mentioned period over-wear often didn't have linings, however, that extra bit of material can be worth having if the outer material isn't dense enough to keep the wind out. Silk was often used for linings on dress clothing, however there's no need to break the bank. If you want silk, used bridgal gowns at second hard stores, flea markets can often be found. Cutting up old garments for the material can save you $$$$.
When you get the pattern, you will very likely have to make adjustments. Patterns for men, focus on waist and chest sizes, not height. The large size is for average figures around 5'10", and 40-42 chest size. The XL if memory serves me, is still for someone about the same height, but with a chest size of 44-circa 46. I'm 6'2", 180 pounds, with a 34" sleeve length. So, I had to adjust the sleeves and length of the coat body in order to fit.
If you know your sleeve length, good. If you're not certain, take a long sleeved shirt and measure the length of the sleeve from the seam line at the shoulder to where the sleeve would/should reach the hand-wrist line. Put the shit on, and have someone mark with tape, or a pint, where the smallest part of your back is. If you have a large waistline (I'm not going to use the word gut), this will probably affect require adjusting the pattern also. We'll get to that in a bit.
Make a tracing of the original pattern, using a thin paper (I often use cheap gift paper from a dollar store). Tape the original to a window, the tracing paper over that, and transfer all of the details from the original. You will use this to make adjustments by cutting and inserting additional paper to lengthen the pattern, or to cut it down. Oh, cutting and pasting requires clear sealing tape. For non-Americans, that's "sticky" tape.
The front-line of the coat will have to be moved so there is at least 3-4 inches of overlap in the front. The side seams will also have to be enlarged so pleats or folds can be added. How many pleats you want is entirely optional. For two pleats, you will need to add another 5" to where the pattern has them. They can be added by sewing a rectangular piece of material that runs along the bottom half of the skirts on each of the panels. Piecing material is a period method seen on many originals as a means of saving material.
The back panels are wider than period garments, however, you might not want to make them narrower. Doing that can take getting the coat on troublesome if you're wearing layers. If you or whoever does the coat isn't good at sewing, take the easy route and leave it as it.
The lower edge of the skirt on the pattern falls a couple of inches above the knee. Determine where you want it be for you. If you need extra length, use a paper "memory stick." That is a piece of paper or something similar that has measured marks that are laid and moved along the edge and marks made where the new edge would be.
The wrist area on the sleeves is very wide roughly 10" on each side, or 20" round. That's far too large. The upper and lower sleeve panels are the same from the elbows down. From there, take 1" off on each edge of both upper and lower sleeves. Start the taper from slightly below where the elbow would be, to the edge of the cuff. While you're adjusting the sleeves, the angle the cuff edge is on, should be changed and about 1" added to bottom side.
Roll-back cuffs are not absolutely necessary. They can be unrolled to fit over the hands, however, the sleeve openings (8" wide for each panel, or 16" in circumference) are large enough I can put my hand in the opposite cuff, all the way to the elbows, even with a sleeved waistcoat/jacket underneath. You can omit them and add them later on. If you choose to add them later, extend the lower edges of the cuffs so they will almost reach your thumb. That's so you can turn the edge under/inside the sleeve without having a raw edge exposed. If you want the cuffs, that requires adjusting the cuff pieces in the pattern. We'll get to that a bit later.
I'll post photos of the drafted and modified traced patterns overlapping, if you can't visualize what was done.
Generally speaking, it's better to have a bit more material, than not enough. (Measure at least twice, cut once!)
More on the way.
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Post by straekat on Dec 12, 2019 8:31:29 GMT -7
Photos of the original pattern and traced/modified patterns overlapped. The front of the coat/capote has the front overlap enlarged, and the curved upper-heat/neckline has been redrawn to straighten the line, and alter the neck opening. The rear skirt has been widened by adding parallel lines to the original pattern line. A yard stick is typically 1" wide, and works nicely for doing this. Lightly draw each additional inch (line) in pencil. This will help you later when you start folding the skirt pleats.  Click once to enlarge, and a second clink will let you look at the image (and those above) in greater detail. |
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