|
Post by brokennock on Jul 12, 2022 17:49:03 GMT -7
I sent a note to Connecticut HS to see if an image could be had of the inside of the Phineas Meigs’ Hat. I’ll keep everyone posted, but I’m going to try to duplicate this as closely as possible… minus the musket ball holes. The musket ball holes…
IF this hat was worn with the cock on the left side, Captain Meigs was shot while the enemy was to his right rear, with the ball entering at about his 4:00.
IF this hat was worn with the cock to the rear in fantail fashion, Meigs was killed by a ball that struck above his right eyebrow, while facing the British.
Without seeing a view of the underside to observe the shape of the crown, it’s just conjecture. But I think this may have been worn fantail. Have you asked the museum about the location of the musket ball holes and their interpretation on how it was worn? Gus I'm thinking front to back. Smaller hole in the front, larger and more irregular exit hole.
|
|
RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
|
Post by RyanAK on Jul 12, 2022 17:49:09 GMT -7
Ok… next hat will be a fully-cocked hat c.1750. Maybe brown. Or grey. Middle-class with some trim. Fur… if I can find an appropriate blank that isn’t heartbreakingly expensive. I really enjoyed this project and want to have a plan and materials on hand for when I need a break between shirts and flintlock.
So… 1750 cocked hat. Was there a particular style that would be most appropriate or common during the era? Seems there was some variation in the style through the decades. Small, very low types in the 1740s to the taller, more “bicorn” style in the period of the AWI. I’m digging through images, but a lot are undated or don’t show the hat well.
|
|
RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
|
Post by RyanAK on Jul 12, 2022 17:59:25 GMT -7
I sent a note to Connecticut HS to see if an image could be had of the inside of the Phineas Meigs’ Hat. I’ll keep everyone posted, but I’m going to try to duplicate this as closely as possible… minus the musket ball holes. The musket ball holes…
IF this hat was worn with the cock on the left side, Captain Meigs was shot while the enemy was to his right rear, with the ball entering at about his 4:00.
IF this hat was worn with the cock to the rear in fantail fashion, Meigs was killed by a ball that struck above his right eyebrow, while facing the British.
Without seeing a view of the underside to observe the shape of the crown, it’s just conjecture. But I think this may have been worn fantail. Have you asked the museum about the location of the musket ball holes and their interpretation on how it was worn? Gus I haven’t. I’ve been communicating with a lovely woman who’s title is ‘digital archivist’. Or something like that. I will, though. I’m sure she’ll put me in touch with the right person. Actually… based on the position of the old holes that exist from the original cocking as a tricorn, I feel pretty confident this was worn fantail. But I’ll still ask their thoughts.
|
|
|
Post by artificer on Jul 13, 2022 5:21:20 GMT -7
Have you asked the museum about the location of the musket ball holes and their interpretation on how it was worn? Gus I haven’t. I’ve been communicating with a lovely woman who’s title is ‘digital archivist’. Or something like that. I will, though. I’m sure she’ll put me in touch with the right person. Actually… based on the position of the old holes that exist from the original cocking as a tricorn, I feel pretty confident this was worn fantail. But I’ll still ask their thoughts. "IF this hat was worn with the cock on the left side, Captain Meigs was shot while the enemy was to his right rear, with the ball entering at about his 4:00."The problem with this is in the fog of war, this was possible even leaving out the possibility the Captain or his Colonel/Commanding Officer ordered a temporary retreat and that's when he got shot. If the Captain leaned over to see to a wounded soldier, he might have got shot that way at just the wrong moment. Finally, the Company is a Captain's offensive weapon. When reloading after a volley fire and even if he was giving the commands to load and fire, it was his duty to look around to see if the position of his company was tenable. If he noticed some unit on his left was either coming up or retreating, he may also have gotten shot this way. Was the Captain ONLY shot through the head and not the body as well? If shot in the body, on the way down to the ground, he could have twisted and got hit in the head this way. IOW, what was going on at the moment the Captain got shot? If the museum folks know this, it could make a difference. Sorry for being morbid, if not a bit gruesome about this, but I think these things need to be considered. Gus
|
|
RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
|
Post by RyanAK on Jul 13, 2022 6:40:29 GMT -7
Here’s what I gathered on the action at East Guilford, CT. I actually just found out I’ll be on this beach at the end of the month. That’s a little spooky…
Meigs was killed in a small action on the beach in East Guilford, CT. A Patriot schooner was chased by a squadron of Loyalist ships and put itself aground. The local militia turned out to protect the vessel. There was a sustained firefight between the militia on the beach and the Loyalists trying to recover the schooner. Loyalist troops were on the schooner and in row barges.
Phineas Meigs was 74 years old and not acting as an officer at the time of his death. He was armed and participating in the fighting with his firelock. Four Loyalists were reported as killed in the action. Meigs was the only Patriot casualty.
I haven’t yet been able to determine where in his life “Captain” was bestowed upon Phineas Meigs.
Accounts state that Meigs was killed instantly by the ball through his head, collapsing into the man standing beside him.
As with the innumerable number of small engagements during the War, specific details are tough to come by. Add to that the local folk tales that develop over time, and it can be tough to discern what actually happened. The above is what I’ve been able to gather as likely factual, based on numerous secondary sources that I feel were based in solid primary source research.
If not for the preservation of the hat and images of it included in various publications, the action at East Guilford would likely have been long forgotten, as would Phineas Meigs. It’s humbling to think of all the small, even tiny, conflicts that occurred during the War that we may never learn about, but for those who participated in them, were the most important events in their lives.
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Jul 13, 2022 8:06:19 GMT -7
Thank you again Ryan, excellent information.
|
|
|
Post by brokennock on Jul 13, 2022 8:12:00 GMT -7
I haven’t. I’ve been communicating with a lovely woman who’s title is ‘digital archivist’. Or something like that. I will, though. I’m sure she’ll put me in touch with the right person. Actually… based on the position of the old holes that exist from the original cocking as a tricorn, I feel pretty confident this was worn fantail. But I’ll still ask their thoughts. "IF this hat was worn with the cock on the left side, Captain Meigs was shot while the enemy was to his right rear, with the ball entering at about his 4:00."The problem with this is in the fog of war, this was possible even leaving out the possibility the Captain or his Colonel/Commanding Officer ordered a temporary retreat and that's when he got shot. If the Captain leaned over to see to a wounded soldier, he might have got shot that way at just the wrong moment. Finally, the Company is a Captain's offensive weapon. When reloading after a volley fire and even if he was giving the commands to load and fire, it was his duty to look around to see if the position of his company was tenable. If he noticed some unit on his left was either coming up or retreating, he may also have gotten shot this way. Was the Captain ONLY shot through the head and not the body as well? If shot in the body, on the way down to the ground, he could have twisted and got hit in the head this way. IOW, what was going on at the moment the Captain got shot? If the museum folks know this, it could make a difference. Sorry for being morbid, if not a bit gruesome about this, but I think these things need to be considered. Gus Not morbid, just real. You raise good points and questions. The biggest thing that makes me doubt my position that the hat was fantail and Meigs was shot from the front, is the height of what would be the entrance hole. I suppose the round could have come from above, maybe even from a vessel on the water. He could also have been looking down to get a cartridge or something needed to load, but I would expect the exit to be lower, possibly not even through the hat then. How much shoot and maneuver would have been going on in an engagement like this at the time? If he fell on the soldier next to him I have to figure they were fighting in closed ranks in line.
|
|
|
Post by artificer on Jul 13, 2022 10:25:17 GMT -7
Here’s what I gathered on the action at East Guilford, CT. I actually just found out I’ll be on this beach at the end of the month. That’s a little spooky… Meigs was killed in a small action on the beach in East Guilford, CT. A Patriot schooner was chased by a squadron of Loyalist ships and put itself aground. The local militia turned out to protect the vessel. There was a sustained firefight between the militia on the beach and the Loyalists trying to recover the schooner. Loyalist troops were on the schooner and in row barges. Phineas Meigs was 74 years old and not acting as an officer at the time of his death. He was armed and participating in the fighting with his firelock. Four Loyalists were reported as killed in the action. Meigs was the only Patriot casualty. I haven’t yet been able to determine where in his life “Captain” was bestowed upon Phineas Meigs. Accounts state that Meigs was killed instantly by the ball through his head, collapsing into the man standing beside him. As with the innumerable number of small engagements during the War, specific details are tough to come by. Add to that the local folk tales that develop over time, and it can be tough to discern what actually happened. The above is what I’ve been able to gather as likely factual, based on numerous secondary sources that I feel were based in solid primary source research. If not for the preservation of the hat and images of it included in various publications, the action at East Guilford would likely have been long forgotten, as would Phineas Meigs. It’s humbling to think of all the small, even tiny, conflicts that occurred during the War that we may never learn about, but for those who participated in them, were the most important events in their lives. Ah, OK, so "Captain" could have possibly come from him captaining a local ship sometime in his past or even an honorarium due to his age? Was the beach the Patriots were fighting from near sea/water level or maybe how higher? The Loyalists firing from the row barges would have been close to as high off the water or maybe a bit lower than a Patriot man standing on the beach near the water. Not sure if the Loyalist Schooner was a coastal schooner or a slightly larger one? Depending on the size of the Loyalist Schooner and how close to shore they got, they might have been a bit higher off the water than the Patriots? I'm trying to get a feel for the angle of their firing towards Phineas and the Patriots. Gus
|
|
RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
|
Post by RyanAK on Jul 13, 2022 10:54:46 GMT -7
"IF this hat was worn with the cock on the left side, Captain Meigs was shot while the enemy was to his right rear, with the ball entering at about his 4:00."The problem with this is in the fog of war, this was possible even leaving out the possibility the Captain or his Colonel/Commanding Officer ordered a temporary retreat and that's when he got shot. If the Captain leaned over to see to a wounded soldier, he might have got shot that way at just the wrong moment. Finally, the Company is a Captain's offensive weapon. When reloading after a volley fire and even if he was giving the commands to load and fire, it was his duty to look around to see if the position of his company was tenable. If he noticed some unit on his left was either coming up or retreating, he may also have gotten shot this way. Was the Captain ONLY shot through the head and not the body as well? If shot in the body, on the way down to the ground, he could have twisted and got hit in the head this way. IOW, what was going on at the moment the Captain got shot? If the museum folks know this, it could make a difference. Sorry for being morbid, if not a bit gruesome about this, but I think these things need to be considered. Gus Not morbid, just real. You raise good points and questions. The biggest thing that makes me doubt my position that the hat was fantail and Meigs was shot from the front, is the height of what would be the entrance hole. I suppose the round could have come from above, maybe even from a vessel on the water. He could also have been looking down to get a cartridge or something needed to load, but I would expect the exit to be lower, possibly not even through the hat then. How much shoot and maneuver would have been going on in an engagement like this at the time? If he fell on the soldier next to him I have to figure they were fighting in closed ranks in line. Couple of quick things. I’m working out some specifics as far as I can with information available, but here’s some of my thoughts that I’m trying to confirm. I discount the exit hole. Projectiles do strange things when they hit bone and brain. I can’t account for the high entry except that these were smoothbores with smoothbore accuracy. I believe the opposing forces were basically static with no maneuver. The Loyalists from Long Island were either on the grounded schooner, or in barges. Because of the beach, the militia was likely in open ranks. We’re talking a 27-man detachment, including an ensign and a serjent. Fighting in closed ranks seems unlikely to me. The opposing strategies were centered on the grounded schooner. The Loyalist we’re trying to drive off the militia detachment so they could get the schooner off and claim it along with its exceptionally valuable cargo of flour. Conversely, the militia was trying to drive off the Loyalists and preserve the vessel. The Loyalist force never put troops on the beach. This likely would have put things in their favor. The Loyalist ships were armed, yet never opened on the militia. The Patriots eventually got a 4lb’er from the village and used it to drive off the Loyalist force. I’m trying to locate a good location for this action so I can use GIS mapping and estimate engagement distances. 🤓
|
|
RyanAK
City-dweller
Once scalped…
Posts: 973
|
Post by RyanAK on Jul 13, 2022 11:01:22 GMT -7
Just a point of clarity. This was a Patriot schooner from Hartford that was jumped by a Loyalist squadron from Long Island. The Patriot crew put their unarmed ship aground at East Guilford to avoid capture by the Loyalists. The Patriot militia turned out to try (successfully) to prevent the Loyalists from taking possession of the Patriot schooner.
|
|
|
Post by artificer on Jul 13, 2022 11:02:55 GMT -7
OK, so if the Loyalists were on a grounded schooner when firing, they would have been higher than the Patriots standing on the beach within musket distance? That would have meant a downward angle of fire towards the Patriots.
Gus
|
|
|
Post by spence on Jul 13, 2022 11:07:36 GMT -7
Gus said, "Ah, OK, so "Captain" could have possibly come from him captaining a local ship sometime in his past or even an honorarium due to his age?"
From the biography of Phineas Meigs:
"Phineas Meigs rose to the rank of Captain in the Militia during the colonial wars, but remained a Private during his career in the Revolutionary War. Enlisting on 3 February 1777 in Colonel William Douglas' 6th Regiment of the Connecticut Line, he was assigned to Captain Samuel Barker's Company. Phineas Meigs was discharged on 3 February 1780. On 3 April 1781, he reenlisted, this time in General David Waterbury's State Brigade under Captain Nathaniel Edwards.
"On 19 May 1782, while attempting to repulse a British landing party on the shore at Guilford, Phineas Meigs was instantly killed by a musket ball through the head; he was buried in West Cemetery, Madison. Captain Phineas Meigs was 74 years old when he died at the Battle for Madison, and he was the last Connecticut man killed during the Revolutionary War."
The only detail I've found about his death is that it is thought he was shot by someone on a barge accompanying the Loyalist ship.
Spence
|
|
|
Post by artificer on Jul 13, 2022 11:55:10 GMT -7
Ok, so he was 36 at the beginning of King George's War (1744–1748) and could have been a Captain then.
Or, he was 46 at the beginning of the FIW (1754–1763) and still might have been a Captain.
When he enlisted in 1777, that would have made him around 69, so yeah I can see how he would not feel right about being a Captain. (I'm within a few months of that age and even with 26 years in the Corps, I would not think I could anymore do an adequate job of being a militia Captain unless they were REALLY hard up for Company Grade Officers. LOL)
Gus
|
|
|
Post by spence on Jul 13, 2022 15:27:42 GMT -7
This discussion of militia rank reminds me of a comment made by Wm. Blane as he toured the Ohio Valley in 1822.
"I must here remark that in the Western States, the tavern keepers are all considerable landed proprietors; and as they have generally a great number of friends and acquaintances, are men of considerable influence. Now the militia have the privilege of choosing their own officers, and consequently the election very often falls upon the tavern keeper of the neighbourhood. Indeed I have rarely stopped at a tavern, in Kentucky, Indiana, Ohio, or Illinois, without finding that the landlord, although clothed from top to bottom in buckskin, and not remarkably clean, was at least a captain, and generally a major or colonel."
Things never change.
Spence
|
|
|
Post by paranger on Jul 13, 2022 15:35:10 GMT -7
Yes: the term "Kentucky colonel" comes to mind - coined to capture that very phenomenon.
|
|